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Author Topic: help required to identify kombi trans cases  (Read 1830 times)
 
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Kimbo
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ksadelaide
« on: July 21, 2009, 05:28:40 PM »
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Guys,

I need a bit of help confirming the type of a couple of kombi trans cases I've got. The first photo is of a complete spare, and I believe itís a 1600 box Ė although I know itís got a 2-litre bell housing on it. The serial number on the bottom of the case is CE 113 9013. I've got another exactly the same, but with a 16-1800 bell housing and Albins gearsets in it.

The second and third photos are of my current race box, again full of Albins gears, which is still in the buggy, so apologies for the quality of the photos, and the side-only views, which may make things tricky for you. I also canít get to see whether there are any serial numbers on it, due to bash plates and tubes, etc.. I believe itís a 2-ltr case, which has a 1600-1800 bell housing (not that you can see that in the photos).

Thanks in advance ... Kimbo


* spare_trans_small.jpg (63.41 KB, 750x562 - viewed 185 times.)

* race trans left small.jpg (324.59 KB, 750x562 - viewed 188 times.)

* race trans right small.jpg (281.19 KB, 750x562 - viewed 189 times.)
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« on: July 21, 2009, 05:28:40 PM »

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« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2009, 08:16:17 PM »
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I sent a note to Joe to have him take a look at this thread.
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Kimbo
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ksadelaide
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2009, 09:14:45 PM »
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Thanks Don, appreciate the help - I'm trying to work out some things regarding adaptor plates, flywheel, clutch and stuff for the engine transplant later this year. The guy that I'm now using to supply the adapator & flywheel asked a bunch of questions, which then caused me to question my understanding of what I had.

It's funny I had two suppliers in mind, one (it turns out) being much cheaper than the other - however, I'm going to use the expensive guy, purely because he asked all the questions. The quality of the end product may be the same, but the questioning has given me more confidence that I'll get what I actually need.

Cheers ... Kimbo
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« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2009, 09:27:39 AM »
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Kimbo, the tranny in your car is commonly called a "5 rib" used up to 72 1/2 with a 5:38 r&p. The other case is called a "3 rib" and has a 4:56 r&p. Bell housing can be changed even tho you may have trouble with sealing them. Hope this helps, Ol' John Cool headbang
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chirco_aircooledvw_parts Chircovwparts
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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2009, 03:02:02 PM »
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well Ol' John nailed it, Sorry for my late response
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« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2009, 03:15:30 PM »
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 Grin
http://www.ratwell.com/technical/Transaxle.html
http://books.google.com/books?id=7xNbfr3_KgoC&pg=PA116&lpg=PA116&dq=vw+ce+transmission+code&source=bl&ots=sgz5IqEk_K&sig=OaKg07vUJmX2sdObQ0OatSdSBdw&hl=en&ei=FoxnSs23NYmwsgPd7fSsBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1
http://www.mmsport.com.au/albins_VW.php
 Grin
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Kimbo
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ksadelaide
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2009, 04:44:42 PM »
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Well, what can I say, you guys came through ! You've confirmed how I confused my adaptor/flywheel man, and then confirmed how my adaptor/flywheel man's confused me. Which in non-Aussie speak means:

Ol'John/Joe: Yep I've always referred to it as a 5-rib 2-ltr box, but adaptor man said nope 2-litre boxes had 6-ribs not 5-ribs - at which point my whole assembled theoretical-pseudo-knowledge of the kombi trans world collapsed in a shivering heap. Until....

Buggyman: Pictures speak a thousand words, 091 case, 2-litre - 5-ribs over that bit that connects to the doobry-thing/CV-joint/flange area (now that's techy speak for you!) and an extra 1 towards the nose cone, totalling 6-ribs

So essentially everyone was right - it actually has 6-ribs, but everyone refers to it as a 5-rib box.

So it's all good. Just how cool are we ??

Many thanks guys, I have faith in my (jack of all trades master of none) limited understanding once again.

Cheers ... Kimbo
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« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2009, 04:44:42 PM »

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« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2009, 10:03:59 PM »
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Grin
"Buggyman: Pictures speak a thousand words, 091 case, 2-litre - 5-ribs over that bit that connects to the doobry-thing/CV-joint/flange area (now that's techy speak for you!) and an extra 1 towards the nose cone, totalling 6-ribs"
Every new Q is a reminder of what had been covered on a one-on-one basis with someone else in the past.Back in the '70's the surfer dudes would stop in to ask which and how this or that thing related to another,the little competition between us behind the counter was to reach down and pick up the right book for his model car and open it directly onto the page in order to reveal a pic of exactly what he was talking about without really being certain of what the heck he was talking about.
The 5/6 rib tranny case was formed in order to accomodate the heavier weight of the more complex later model busses without much particularly adding more weight or changing the rest of the well proven inner workings aside from the final drive which compensated for the change in height of the tires.
The added weight of the later busses also meant that there was a lot more internal torque force to contain so when thought about it in an abstract manner it's like the difference between holding the handle of a sledge hammer with two hands instead of just one hand(twice as many hands and fingers = twice as many ribs).
Tossing a trans that strong into a vehicle that weighs so much(probably 1/3rd) less than what it was originally designed for means you can throw more abuse at it without it exploding at the one spot that most of that force is transferred,the differential.
If it comes down to running the spare 3 rib,gotta keep in mind the difference between the final drive ratios,meaning you'll hafta change out to a different height tire selection in order to maintain the same driving charateristics,taller for more wide open course designs,shorter for more close quarters twisty course designs.

Any progress toward a dashpot setup or are you just gonna hold off on that 'till the injection system shows up?
 Grin
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Kimbo
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ksadelaide
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2009, 11:05:10 PM »
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Yep understand Buggyman. The spare is exactly that, definitely a spare, and I don't necessarily intend to use it unless the race box destroys itself and I don't have time to fix it before the next race (assuming I actually want to enter it). I'm also running kombi CV's on the basis that they should break before the trans does.

Neither of the boxes have original internals and I've actually no idea of the gear and final drive ratios in either, so whilst I'm swapping the engines I'll get them both serviced and find out what's in there. It would be nice to have the luxury of being able to swap the trans based on the type of circuit, but I've got other things to think consider that would probably be more beneficial - e.g. rework the front suspension, better coils, shocks etc.. doesn't matter how fast the car could go, if it doesn't comfortably deal with the bumps and jumps in between the straights and bends

As for the dashpot, I'm currently looking at only another 3-races this season (assuming I don't break anything in the interim) and given that I think we've probably figured out what causes it, I'll try it without any mods and see what happens, it's probably time I learned how to "heel and toe" properly anyway. And as the "new" SR20 engine's sitting in a garage down the road, waiting for me to go and pick it up, I'm thinking more about the future, rather than concentrating on the past.

Kimbo
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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2009, 09:49:28 AM »
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 Grin
"but I've got other things to think consider that would probably be more beneficial - e.g. rework the front suspension, better coils, shocks etc.. doesn't matter how fast the car could go, if it doesn't comfortably deal with the bumps and jumps in between the straights and bends"

I've been mulling that over for the last few days and took another looong look at your pics,one thing that stands out is the lack of boots or sheilds over the shock shafts in order to help keep dust and water off the shaft seals into the shocks,both of which etch the shafts and tear up the seals over a relatively short time,softening up the ride,something along the lines of http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&um=1&sa=1&q=shock+boots&btnG=Search+images&aq=f&oq=  Wink .
 Grin

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Kimbo
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ksadelaide
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2009, 05:10:32 PM »
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Hadn't necessarily thought of them - and I can't say I've seen them used a lot over here, which isn't to say that they shouldn't be used, they're just not, at present. However, having said that, they're not a bad idea - might grab myself a couple of pairs. And with you mentioning the wear on the shafts and seals, I might just go and give them a check at the weekend.

I've got something along these lines on the rear Fox's, which (to my surprise) do a pretty good job of keeping the shaft clean, and allow for stuff to drain out - in fact after the last event, the rear shafts were almost spotless, which is more than could be said for the areas above and bellow.



* suspension dirtbagz.jpg (4.32 KB, 249x232 - viewed 104 times.)
« Last Edit: July 27, 2009, 05:15:36 PM by treelineracing » Logged

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